Vantage 8.03 Implementation and Terminal server

Yahoo Archive
1
Thanks Jason,

I appreciate your input.

Brian


--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Jason Claggett" <jason@...> wrote:
>
> Brian,
>
>
>
> I haven't seen any responses to this yet from other users, so I'll
post
> my observations. I have several customers that use just the MES
feature
> and we see anywhere from 50MB - 89MB of memory per session (includes
> winlogin.exe, mfgsys.exe, etc...). So in your scenario you could
assume
> 1.7GB of RAM for 25 active sessions (I used 70MB as an average and
then
> X #users). If you will be just using this for terminal server then
you
> should be fine with Windows 2003 Standard R2...If you want to run
> Vantage as well, you might consider Enterprise Edition and put
Vantage
> and Terminal Server on the same server - we've seen this to be very
> effective and you don't have to deal with the loss of connectivity
issue
> that come with running terminal server and Vantage on separate
servers.
>
>
>
> Not knowing everything about your database or environment these are
just
> rough scenarios and not an exact science :-).
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
> Jason Claggett
>
> Microsoft Small Business Specialist
>
> MCP #3856159
>
> 2W Technologies, LLC
>
> 317.578.2393
>
> jason@...
>
> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf
> Of Brian Stenglein
> Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 8:27 AM
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Vantage] Re: Vantage 8.03 Implementation and Terminal
server
>
>
>
> For those of you using Terminal Sever with 8.X, can you comment on
> the server needs of data collection sessions? We are currently on
> 6.1 and have 25 data collection sessions running on a Terminal
Server
> that is pretty long in the tooth. I'm assuming we'll need a new
one,
> but I'm hoping the needs of data collections won't be as great as
> full blown users. Can anyone comment on that?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Brian Stenglein
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> "Gary Franks" <garyfr2003@> wrote:
> >
> > We also are using TServer for all remote users, & I echo the
> previous
> > sentiments....about 20 users max per TServer box, so we have 3.
> > Sessions in Vantage can 'hang' if there's even the
slightest 'blip'
> in
> > connectivity, causing large scale maintenance issues for our
small
> IT
> > staff. Pretty much, we're losing lots of sleep.
> >
> > - Gary -
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%
40yahoogroups.com> ,
> "mseal" <mseal@> wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%
40yahoogroups.com> ,
> "Tim Goertz" <tim.goertz@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hello-
> > > >
> > > > It's been awhile since I have emailed the list (being
basically
> a 2
> > > > person IT dept. and supporting about 100 + users keeps us
> pretty busy
> > > > here so I haven't had much time to keep up with the list).
> Although
> > > > still very much in the planning stages, we have decided to
> finally
> > move
> > > > from version 5.2 to V8 sometime over the next year and based
on
> the
> > > > hardware spec requirements for V8 we are aware that we will
> have to
> > > > either replace nearly every PC on our network (like I said
100
> +, 1
> > > > site) or implement V8 using terminal server as the base for
our
> > clients
> > > > access. Obviously, it seems even with the licensing
> requirements for
> > > > terminal server it would be much more economical to go that
> route
> > rather
> > > > than replacing all of our PC's and I would think would also be
> > easier to
> > > > manage and support the Vantage clients. Has anyone experienced
> > moving to
> > > > V8 with a large number of terminal server clients or
> exclusively using
> > > > terminal server? Is there any down side to running V8 via
> terminal
> > > > server vs. the full client (i.e. printing issues)? Again any
> and all
> > > > input would be appreciated. Thanks.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Tim Goertz
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > > Hi Tim,
> > > We have just started this week using 8.03 (live) and many of
our
> users
> > > are accessing via Terminal Server (2003)
> > > I would recommend against using it as each client may be using
> 150 -
> > > 300Mb memory and you will run out very fast.
> > > We have 2 TS servers, one running in VMWare, the other physical
> box -
> > > we can run 10-20 users per box before it becomes slow
> > > VM has 4 Gb physical box has 2 Gb
> > > Hope this helps
> > >
> > > Motty
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
2
Hello-

It's been awhile since I have emailed the list (being basically a 2
person IT dept. and supporting about 100 + users keeps us pretty busy
here so I haven't had much time to keep up with the list). Although
still very much in the planning stages, we have decided to finally move
from version 5.2 to V8 sometime over the next year and based on the
hardware spec requirements for V8 we are aware that we will have to
either replace nearly every PC on our network (like I said 100 +, 1
site) or implement V8 using terminal server as the base for our clients
access. Obviously, it seems even with the licensing requirements for
terminal server it would be much more economical to go that route rather
than replacing all of our PC's and I would think would also be easier to
manage and support the Vantage clients. Has anyone experienced moving to
V8 with a large number of terminal server clients or exclusively using
terminal server? Is there any down side to running V8 via terminal
server vs. the full client (i.e. printing issues)? Again any and all
input would be appreciated. Thanks.


Tim Goertz




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
3
No issues that I know of. We have several clients who use this and it
appears to work just fine. Printing - as long as it is done internally -
won't be an issue because you can just create shared printers and use
the 2003 server for a print server, etc...if you have remote users your
printing is a little more touchy and requires a bit more "tinkering",
but Win2k3 has made it much better to use this functionality - one tip:
don't use PCL drivers BAD, BAD, BAD!!



Depending on how many users you are looking at you may consider running
a Citrix server farm and load balancing them across the network...up to
you but it should work well - unlike earlier versions which require
quite a bit of extra configuration.



Hope this helps.



Thanks,



Jason Claggett

Microsoft Small Business Specialist

MCP #3856159

2W Technologies, LLC

317.578.2393

jason@...

From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Tim Goertz
Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 3:32 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Vantage 8.03 Implementation and Terminal server



Hello-

It's been awhile since I have emailed the list (being basically a 2
person IT dept. and supporting about 100 + users keeps us pretty busy
here so I haven't had much time to keep up with the list). Although
still very much in the planning stages, we have decided to finally move
from version 5.2 to V8 sometime over the next year and based on the
hardware spec requirements for V8 we are aware that we will have to
either replace nearly every PC on our network (like I said 100 +, 1
site) or implement V8 using terminal server as the base for our clients
access. Obviously, it seems even with the licensing requirements for
terminal server it would be much more economical to go that route rather
than replacing all of our PC's and I would think would also be easier to
manage and support the Vantage clients. Has anyone experienced moving to
V8 with a large number of terminal server clients or exclusively using
terminal server? Is there any down side to running V8 via terminal
server vs. the full client (i.e. printing issues)? Again any and all
input would be appreciated. Thanks.


Tim Goertz

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
4
--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Tim Goertz" <tim.goertz@...> wrote:
>
> Hello-
>
> It's been awhile since I have emailed the list (being basically a 2
> person IT dept. and supporting about 100 + users keeps us pretty busy
> here so I haven't had much time to keep up with the list). Although
> still very much in the planning stages, we have decided to finally move
> from version 5.2 to V8 sometime over the next year and based on the
> hardware spec requirements for V8 we are aware that we will have to
> either replace nearly every PC on our network (like I said 100 +, 1
> site) or implement V8 using terminal server as the base for our clients
> access. Obviously, it seems even with the licensing requirements for
> terminal server it would be much more economical to go that route rather
> than replacing all of our PC's and I would think would also be easier to
> manage and support the Vantage clients. Has anyone experienced moving to
> V8 with a large number of terminal server clients or exclusively using
> terminal server? Is there any down side to running V8 via terminal
> server vs. the full client (i.e. printing issues)? Again any and all
> input would be appreciated. Thanks.
>
>
> Tim Goertz
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
Hi Tim,
We have just started this week using 8.03 (live) and many of our users
are accessing via Terminal Server (2003)
I would recommend against using it as each client may be using 150 –
300Mb memory and you will run out very fast.
We have 2 TS servers, one running in VMWare, the other physical box –
we can run 10-20 users per box before it becomes slow
VM has 4 Gb physical box has 2 Gb
Hope this helps

Motty
5
We also are using TServer for all remote users, & I echo the previous
sentiments....about 20 users max per TServer box, so we have 3.
Sessions in Vantage can 'hang' if there's even the slightest 'blip' in
connectivity, causing large scale maintenance issues for our small IT
staff. Pretty much, we're losing lots of sleep.

- Gary -

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "mseal" <mseal@...> wrote:
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Tim Goertz" <tim.goertz@> wrote:
> >
> > Hello-
> >
> > It's been awhile since I have emailed the list (being basically a 2
> > person IT dept. and supporting about 100 + users keeps us pretty busy
> > here so I haven't had much time to keep up with the list). Although
> > still very much in the planning stages, we have decided to finally
move
> > from version 5.2 to V8 sometime over the next year and based on the
> > hardware spec requirements for V8 we are aware that we will have to
> > either replace nearly every PC on our network (like I said 100 +, 1
> > site) or implement V8 using terminal server as the base for our
clients
> > access. Obviously, it seems even with the licensing requirements for
> > terminal server it would be much more economical to go that route
rather
> > than replacing all of our PC's and I would think would also be
easier to
> > manage and support the Vantage clients. Has anyone experienced
moving to
> > V8 with a large number of terminal server clients or exclusively using
> > terminal server? Is there any down side to running V8 via terminal
> > server vs. the full client (i.e. printing issues)? Again any and all
> > input would be appreciated. Thanks.
> >
> >
> > Tim Goertz
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> Hi Tim,
> We have just started this week using 8.03 (live) and many of our users
> are accessing via Terminal Server (2003)
> I would recommend against using it as each client may be using 150 –
> 300Mb memory and you will run out very fast.
> We have 2 TS servers, one running in VMWare, the other physical box –
> we can run 10-20 users per box before it becomes slow
> VM has 4 Gb physical box has 2 Gb
> Hope this helps
>
> Motty
>
6
For those of you using Terminal Sever with 8.X, can you comment on
the server needs of data collection sessions? We are currently on
6.1 and have 25 data collection sessions running on a Terminal Server
that is pretty long in the tooth. I'm assuming we'll need a new one,
but I'm hoping the needs of data collections won't be as great as
full blown users. Can anyone comment on that?

Thanks,

Brian Stenglein


--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Gary Franks" <garyfr2003@...> wrote:
>
> We also are using TServer for all remote users, & I echo the
previous
> sentiments....about 20 users max per TServer box, so we have 3.
> Sessions in Vantage can 'hang' if there's even the slightest 'blip'
in
> connectivity, causing large scale maintenance issues for our small
IT
> staff. Pretty much, we're losing lots of sleep.
>
> - Gary -
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "mseal" <mseal@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Tim Goertz" <tim.goertz@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hello-
> > >
> > > It's been awhile since I have emailed the list (being basically
a 2
> > > person IT dept. and supporting about 100 + users keeps us
pretty busy
> > > here so I haven't had much time to keep up with the list).
Although
> > > still very much in the planning stages, we have decided to
finally
> move
> > > from version 5.2 to V8 sometime over the next year and based on
the
> > > hardware spec requirements for V8 we are aware that we will
have to
> > > either replace nearly every PC on our network (like I said 100
+, 1
> > > site) or implement V8 using terminal server as the base for our
> clients
> > > access. Obviously, it seems even with the licensing
requirements for
> > > terminal server it would be much more economical to go that
route
> rather
> > > than replacing all of our PC's and I would think would also be
> easier to
> > > manage and support the Vantage clients. Has anyone experienced
> moving to
> > > V8 with a large number of terminal server clients or
exclusively using
> > > terminal server? Is there any down side to running V8 via
terminal
> > > server vs. the full client (i.e. printing issues)? Again any
and all
> > > input would be appreciated. Thanks.
> > >
> > >
> > > Tim Goertz
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > Hi Tim,
> > We have just started this week using 8.03 (live) and many of our
users
> > are accessing via Terminal Server (2003)
> > I would recommend against using it as each client may be using
150 –
> > 300Mb memory and you will run out very fast.
> > We have 2 TS servers, one running in VMWare, the other physical
box –
> > we can run 10-20 users per box before it becomes slow
> > VM has 4 Gb physical box has 2 Gb
> > Hope this helps
> >
> > Motty
> >
>
7
Brian,



I haven't seen any responses to this yet from other users, so I'll post
my observations. I have several customers that use just the MES feature
and we see anywhere from 50MB - 89MB of memory per session (includes
winlogin.exe, mfgsys.exe, etc...). So in your scenario you could assume
1.7GB of RAM for 25 active sessions (I used 70MB as an average and then
X #users). If you will be just using this for terminal server then you
should be fine with Windows 2003 Standard R2...If you want to run
Vantage as well, you might consider Enterprise Edition and put Vantage
and Terminal Server on the same server - we've seen this to be very
effective and you don't have to deal with the loss of connectivity issue
that come with running terminal server and Vantage on separate servers.



Not knowing everything about your database or environment these are just
rough scenarios and not an exact science :-).



Thanks,



Jason Claggett

Microsoft Small Business Specialist

MCP #3856159

2W Technologies, LLC

317.578.2393

jason@...

From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Brian Stenglein
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 8:27 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Vantage 8.03 Implementation and Terminal server



For those of you using Terminal Sever with 8.X, can you comment on
the server needs of data collection sessions? We are currently on
6.1 and have 25 data collection sessions running on a Terminal Server
that is pretty long in the tooth. I'm assuming we'll need a new one,
but I'm hoping the needs of data collections won't be as great as
full blown users. Can anyone comment on that?

Thanks,

Brian Stenglein

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"Gary Franks" <garyfr2003@...> wrote:
>
> We also are using TServer for all remote users, & I echo the
previous
> sentiments....about 20 users max per TServer box, so we have 3.
> Sessions in Vantage can 'hang' if there's even the slightest 'blip'
in
> connectivity, causing large scale maintenance issues for our small
IT
> staff. Pretty much, we're losing lots of sleep.
>
> - Gary -
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"mseal" <mseal@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"Tim Goertz" <tim.goertz@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hello-
> > >
> > > It's been awhile since I have emailed the list (being basically
a 2
> > > person IT dept. and supporting about 100 + users keeps us
pretty busy
> > > here so I haven't had much time to keep up with the list).
Although
> > > still very much in the planning stages, we have decided to
finally
> move
> > > from version 5.2 to V8 sometime over the next year and based on
the
> > > hardware spec requirements for V8 we are aware that we will
have to
> > > either replace nearly every PC on our network (like I said 100
+, 1
> > > site) or implement V8 using terminal server as the base for our
> clients
> > > access. Obviously, it seems even with the licensing
requirements for
> > > terminal server it would be much more economical to go that
route
> rather
> > > than replacing all of our PC's and I would think would also be
> easier to
> > > manage and support the Vantage clients. Has anyone experienced
> moving to
> > > V8 with a large number of terminal server clients or
exclusively using
> > > terminal server? Is there any down side to running V8 via
terminal
> > > server vs. the full client (i.e. printing issues)? Again any
and all
> > > input would be appreciated. Thanks.
> > >
> > >
> > > Tim Goertz
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > Hi Tim,
> > We have just started this week using 8.03 (live) and many of our
users
> > are accessing via Terminal Server (2003)
> > I would recommend against using it as each client may be using
150 -
> > 300Mb memory and you will run out very fast.
> > We have 2 TS servers, one running in VMWare, the other physical
box -
> > we can run 10-20 users per box before it becomes slow
> > VM has 4 Gb physical box has 2 Gb
> > Hope this helps
> >
> > Motty
> >
>





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]