Mark,
First of all, let me say THANK YOU VERY MUCH for responding to users'
concerns about the product. This is a very welcome change from Epicor's
lack of response in the past!
I have heard a rumor that the SQL database does not have any triggers, but
depends on the Progress triggers to handle data requests from eMan
(Vantage). Here's a scenario that concerns me: say I'm running eMan with
the SQL database and I let users connect to the database via Microsoft
Access so that they can slice and dice the data any way they want (my users
would LOVE this). But a well-intentioned user wants to get rid of some part
number from his result set and deletes the record rather than change the
query. Oops, he just deleted a Part record and now my data integrity is
down the tubes because I still have all the PartTran records (etc., etc.)
still in the database.
Obviously this is just the tip of the data-integrity iceberg, so this is a
huge concern for me. Can you shed any light on how realistic this situation
could be?
And thanks again for answering our concerns!
================
Steve Sanders
Delta Centrifugal Corp.
-----Original Message-----
From: Mark Pladson [mailto:
mpladson@...]
Sent: Friday, January 05, 2001 8:27 AM
To:
vantage@egroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] Vantage 5.0 Sql???
The decision to move to the SQL database is based on your business and IT
needs. Epicor is neither encouraging nor discouraging moving to a SQL
database. The SQL database is not required for integration with any other
Epicor common products. Anytime you convert from one database to another,
it will require conversion of data and some down time.
I have made other comments below in hopes to shed some light on this
topic.
I am in meetings for the balance of the day but would be happy to reply to
other concerns with SQL at a later time.
Mark Pladson
Product Manager
eManufacturing Powered by Vantage
Epicor Software Corporation
www.epicor.com
Phone # 952-417-5187
Fax # 952-582-5478
email address
MPladson@...
-----Original Message-----
From: Ted Kitch [mailto:
ted@...]
Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 10:54 AM
To:
vantage@egroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] Vantage 5.0 Sql???
From everything that I've seen of the SQL Server support, I wouldn't
recommend anyone changing at this time. I know this will surprise most of
you, but the support for SQL Server that Epicor has added is, to put it
plainly, not very well thought out.
First off they use the Progress Data Server product (basically a
middleman)
to pump the info to SQL Server while using the existing Progress code to
run
Vantage. I see this as a quick way to get the product to market, but not
the best move for the existing user base. It also adds (IMHO) unneeded
overhead to the process. This particular method won't take advantage of
everything that SQL Server has to offer.
eManufacturing - The use of the Progress Data Server allows us to use a
common set of source code for Progress, SQL and perhaps other databases in
the future. The Progress Data Server does add some overhead but the
effect
on performance are minimal based our testing at Microsoft this fall.
Secondly, the SQL Server database doesn't have any indexing and the way it
is setup and implemented just doesn't make sense. This really hampers
performance. SQL Server is a very fast database server (I would agree
with
earlier postings that the Progress database is faster), but not having any
indexing is beyond my comprehension. Security is implemented just as good
with SQL Server as it with the Progress databases (basically wide open).
eManufacturing - The SQL database and Progress database are essentially
identical and have the same indexing on every table. There are some
differences in data types because Progress and SQL do not share the same
data type definitions.
Finally, the upgrade path to SQL Server is just plain dumb. How many
businesses of any substance can afford the time required to have the
database down to switch it over? Not to mention the cost of having on
on-site visit to minimize the time needed.
eManufacturing - During the conversion process all the data from your
Progress database is dumped using Progress Data Administration tools. The
data is written into the SQL database using Epicor's conversion program.
Depending on the size of your database this process can take a
considerable
amount of time even with a powerful multi-processor server. The presence
of
a skilled Epicor IT professional is required because it is important for
you
that this process goes smoothly.
The return on investment just isn't there yet. I don't see any reason why
anyone would upgrade to the SQL Server portion of Vantage. It would be
nice
if the marketing boys would find something else to dedicate their
attention
to, instead of quick solutions that don't really solve any problems. I
wish
there was a drug to cure the "featureitus" that they have. Just having a
feature doesn't necessarily make the product better.
That's my two cents worth.
Ted Kitch
ted@...
----- Original Message -----
From: Britt Moelling
To: vantage@egroups.com
Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Vantage] Vantage 5.0 Sql???
To All
I found out from Epicore that there is NO upgrade path from Progress
to SQL at this time, unless you send your data to Epicor for conversion
(which is IMPOSSIBLE for us). The only option is to have Epicor come
down and convert the Progress data on site, which would cost $5000 plus
(unknown amount of time).
Britt Moelling
M&M Manufacturing Co.
Dina Hieber wrote:
> My boss wanted me to find out how many users will change over to SQL
> when you convert to 5.0? Any advantages?
>
> Thanks,
> Dina
> Vamco International, Inc.
>
>
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--
Britt Moelling
M&M Manufacturing Co., Inc.
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