[Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location [SMC WIRE FABRICAT

Yahoo Archive
1
Yeah, I would too but my Clie' is in there and , well...priorities you know...

Rick
----- Original Message -----
From: Scott Hemmerlein
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2002 5:10 PM
Subject: RE: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location [SMC WIRE FABRICATORS]


I put my tape in my shirt pocket, if we have a fire, as long as I get out
the tape does to!

-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Gors [mailto:rgors@...]
Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 8:28 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location [SMC
WIRE FABRICATORS]


You might hit him up for a DVD burner. That would give you 4.7 gig
capacity.

Personally, I just got myself into the habit of putting last nights tape
into my briefcase each morning and pulling out the old one. It gives a
pretty secure feeling because I don't have to count on anyone else to do it.

Rick Gors



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
2
Hello Everyone,

My boss wants me to figure away to back up our entire network to a
computer at his house. Can anyone give me any insite. Advantages or
Disadvantages? Or is anyone else doing this. We only have a DSL line
and that is also what he has. I do not even know where to begin to
figure this out. As you can tellt his is a little out of my league.

--
Dina M. Hieber
Vamco International, Inc.
555 Epsilon Drive
Pittsburgh, PA 15238
(412) 963-7100 - phone
(412) 963-9511 - fax

www.vamcointernational.com
3
How much information do you have? I don't think any sort of remote backup
would be feasible. It would take too long and be too complex.

Get some sort of tape backup unit for your server and run the backups to it.
If your boss feel safer having a backup stored offsite at his house, let him
store the tapes.

Brian Boyes,
Systems Administrator,
Precision Resource Canada Ltd.
<http://www.precisionresource.com>
<mailto:brianb@...>

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dina Hieber [mailto:dhieber@...]
> Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 11:41 AM
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location
>
>
> Hello Everyone,
>
> My boss wants me to figure away to back up our entire network to a
> computer at his house. Can anyone give me any insite. Advantages or
> Disadvantages? Or is anyone else doing this. We only have a DSL line
> and that is also what he has. I do not even know where to begin to
> figure this out. As you can tellt his is a little out of my league.
>
> --
> Dina M. Hieber
> Vamco International, Inc.
> 555 Epsilon Drive
> Pittsburgh, PA 15238
> (412) 963-7100 - phone
> (412) 963-9511 - fax
>
> www.vamcointernational.com
>
>
>
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> to enable access. )
> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report
> Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services
> goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
>
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>
>
4
Backup Tapes, or a Removeable IDE Hard Drive bay.

Backing up a multi-gig server over dsl could take days, and possibly a bit
unstable.

Thaddeus

-----Original Message-----
From: Dina Hieber [mailto:dhieber@...]
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 8:41 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location


Hello Everyone,

My boss wants me to figure away to back up our entire network to a
computer at his house. Can anyone give me any insite. Advantages or
Disadvantages? Or is anyone else doing this. We only have a DSL line
and that is also what he has. I do not even know where to begin to
figure this out. As you can tellt his is a little out of my league.

--
Dina M. Hieber
Vamco International, Inc.
555 Epsilon Drive
Pittsburgh, PA 15238
(412) 963-7100 - phone
(412) 963-9511 - fax

www.vamcointernational.com




Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
5
Hi Dina,

If your boss is like mine, he wants numbers. A simple NO will never work.
My DSL service is a basic package. Yours may be similar.

384kbps - 1.5mbps download speed - coming into my computer.
128kbps going out of my computer.
That's bits per second, not bytes. (from old teletype days)
I don't know if DSL uses start and stop bits, but I'll assume it does.
Figure 8 data bits, 1 start bit and 1 stop bit gives you a 10 to 1 ratio
of bits to bytes.
Now figure a 2 gigabyte file like many Vantage databases.
2,000,000,000 bytes or 20,000,000,000 bits. divide by 128,000 bits per
second.
You get 156,250 seconds or 2,604 min. or 43.4 hours. - Almost 2 days !
Not very practical. Tape backup with off site storage will be the most
efficient.

Bob Bruton

If I messed up the numbers - please enlighten me.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
6
At 11:40 AM 2/4/2002 -0500, you wrote:
>My boss wants me to figure away to back up our entire network to a
>computer at his house. Can anyone give me any insight? Advantages or

Hehe... Sure. Burn it off to a tape and hand it to him to take home with
him each day :)

Seriously... that might have been feasible back in the days of 20MB (not
GB!) hard drives, but with files the size they are nowadays, even DSL
bandwidth won't go far. At full T1 speeds, you'll get about 500MB per
hour. If you compress the files first, maybe 2X that. I suppose that
would be enough for a few select critical files, but not a whole network.

-Wayne Cox
7
Actually, if all you want is the backup of a database, it may well be
feasible. Let's figure a 1 gig db. after zipping up the online backup file,
it shrinks it down to 200mb which you could upload in a matter of 3-4 hours,
with a fairly average DSL lines. And because you can do it with a script, I
would trust it much more then somebody having to manually take the tape
offsite. But, like they say the best protection is redundancy, so if it is
critical, I would use tape, burn a compressed copy to a CD and have the file
uploaded somewhere as well.


Oleg Tumarkin
Intelligent Systems Integration
(330) 335-5291
olegt@...

"Making Intelligent Use of Technology"

-----Original Message-----
From: Wayne Cox [mailto:wmc20@...]
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 12:13 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location


At 11:40 AM 2/4/2002 -0500, you wrote:
>My boss wants me to figure away to back up our entire network to a
>computer at his house. Can anyone give me any insight? Advantages or

Hehe... Sure. Burn it off to a tape and hand it to him to take home with
him each day :)

Seriously... that might have been feasible back in the days of 20MB (not
GB!) hard drives, but with files the size they are nowadays, even DSL
bandwidth won't go far. At full T1 speeds, you'll get about 500MB per
hour. If you compress the files first, maybe 2X that. I suppose that
would be enough for a few select critical files, but not a whole network.

-Wayne Cox





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<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.>
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
8
If a tape or CD's won't work, then set up a hot-swappable, removable
hard drive equal in size to your network storage. Install this on the
server (if it accepts hot-swappable drives) then backup using a script
or batch file at night. Depending on how you do your tape backup and
archive flags, you could set this up to copy only changed files thus
limiting the time each night and do a full copy on the weekends.

This is not the best solution. A tape solution is best as it wouldn't
tie up your network or server for long periods of time, and you are
already backing up by tape. Perhaps a candid and frank discussion with
your boss might be appropriate as over time this will surely create a
nightmare.

Dina Hieber wrote:
>
> Hello Everyone,
>
> My boss wants me to figure away to back up our entire network to a
> computer at his house. Can anyone give me any insite. Advantages or
> Disadvantages? Or is anyone else doing this. We only have a DSL line
> and that is also what he has. I do not even know where to begin to
> figure this out. As you can tellt his is a little out of my league.
>
> --
> Dina M. Hieber
> Vamco International, Inc.
> 555 Epsilon Drive
> Pittsburgh, PA 15238
> (412) 963-7100 - phone
> (412) 963-9511 - fax
>
> www.vamcointernational.com
>
>
> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> (2) To search through old msg's goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

--
John Himebaugh, MIS
InterOcean Systems, Inc.
3540 Aero Court
San Diego, CA 92123
Voice: 858.565.8400
Fax: 858.268.9695
9
Thanks to everyone who replied. All the information is helpful. We
currently take a tape off site but it thought this would be easier.

Thanks,

Dina

John Himebaugh wrote:

> If a tape or CD's won't work, then set up a hot-swappable, removable
> hard drive equal in size to your network storage. Install this on the
>
> server (if it accepts hot-swappable drives) then backup using a script
>
> or batch file at night. Depending on how you do your tape backup and
> archive flags, you could set this up to copy only changed files thus
> limiting the time each night and do a full copy on the weekends.
>
> This is not the best solution. A tape solution is best as it wouldn't
>
> tie up your network or server for long periods of time, and you are
> already backing up by tape. Perhaps a candid and frank discussion
> with
> your boss might be appropriate as over time this will surely create a
> nightmare.
>
> Dina Hieber wrote:
> >
> > Hello Everyone,
> >
> > My boss wants me to figure away to back up our entire network to a
> > computer at his house. Can anyone give me any insite. Advantages
> or
> > Disadvantages? Or is anyone else doing this. We only have a DSL
> line
> > and that is also what he has. I do not even know where to begin to
> > figure this out. As you can tellt his is a little out of my league.
>
> >
> > --
> > Dina M. Hieber
> > Vamco International, Inc.
> > 555 Epsilon Drive
> > Pittsburgh, PA 15238
> > (412) 963-7100 - phone
> > (412) 963-9511 - fax
> >
> > www.vamcointernational.com
> >
> >
> > Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You
> must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable
> access. )
> > (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report
> Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> > (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> > (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
> --
> John Himebaugh, MIS
> InterOcean Systems, Inc.
> 3540 Aero Court
> San Diego, CA 92123
> Voice: 858.565.8400
> Fax: 858.268.9695
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT


>
> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
> have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access.
> )
> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder
> and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

--
Dina M. Hieber
Vamco International, Inc.
555 Epsilon Drive
Pittsburgh, PA 15238
(412) 963-7100 - phone
(412) 963-9511 - fax

www.vamcointernational.com



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
10
Thanks for the bit/byte education, Robert. That was worth the whole thread for me. We're looking at internet access speeds and I see a 384kbps and think WOW! Is that the same measurement as 56K? In other words, is a 384kbps download speed actually 6.9 times faster than 56K, and is 128Kbps 4.5 times faster than 28.8?

And Shirley, what is the download/upload performance on your two-way Satellite internet service?

Troy Funte
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Bruton
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 12:06 PM
Subject: RE: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location


Hi Dina,

If your boss is like mine, he wants numbers. A simple NO will never work.
My DSL service is a basic package. Yours may be similar.

384kbps - 1.5mbps download speed - coming into my computer.
128kbps going out of my computer.
That's bits per second, not bytes. (from old teletype days)
I don't know if DSL uses start and stop bits, but I'll assume it does.
Figure 8 data bits, 1 start bit and 1 stop bit gives you a 10 to 1 ratio
of bits to bytes.
Now figure a 2 gigabyte file like many Vantage databases.
2,000,000,000 bytes or 20,000,000,000 bits. divide by 128,000 bits per
second.
You get 156,250 seconds or 2,604 min. or 43.4 hours. - Almost 2 days !
Not very practical. Tape backup with off site storage will be the most
efficient.

Bob Bruton

If I messed up the numbers - please enlighten me.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT




Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
11
Yes. Kb is kilobit (small b), KB is kilobyte. The same goes with network
communications. Your 10Mb ethernet connection is 10 megaBIT.

Brian

> -----Original Message-----
> Thanks for the bit/byte education, Robert. That was worth the
> whole thread for me. We're looking at internet access speeds
> and I see a 384kbps and think WOW! Is that the same
> measurement as 56K? In other words, is a 384kbps download
> speed actually 6.9 times faster than 56K, and is 128Kbps 4.5
> times faster than 28.8?
12
Directway advertises an average of 400kbs download, I usually average about
600kbs, have hit 800kbs when net traffic was low and have hit 1100kbs in the
wee hours. Last week I downloaded a 34 megabyte file in 1.45 minutes.
Upload is a consistant 128kbs.

Shirley
-----Original Message-----
From: Troy Funte [mailto:tfunte@...]
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 3:12 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location


Thanks for the bit/byte education, Robert. That was worth the whole thread
for me. We're looking at internet access speeds and I see a 384kbps and
think WOW! Is that the same measurement as 56K? In other words, is a
384kbps download speed actually 6.9 times faster than 56K, and is 128Kbps
4.5 times faster than 28.8?

And Shirley, what is the download/upload performance on your two-way
Satellite internet service?

Troy Funte
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Bruton
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2002 12:06 PM
Subject: RE: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location


Hi Dina,

If your boss is like mine, he wants numbers. A simple NO will never
work.
My DSL service is a basic package. Yours may be similar.

384kbps - 1.5mbps download speed - coming into my computer.
128kbps going out of my computer.
That's bits per second, not bytes. (from old teletype days)
I don't know if DSL uses start and stop bits, but I'll assume it does.
Figure 8 data bits, 1 start bit and 1 stop bit gives you a 10 to 1
ratio
of bits to bytes.
Now figure a 2 gigabyte file like many Vantage databases.
2,000,000,000 bytes or 20,000,000,000 bits. divide by 128,000 bits per
second.
You get 156,250 seconds or 2,604 min. or 43.4 hours. - Almost 2 days !
Not very practical. Tape backup with off site storage will be the most
efficient.

Bob Bruton

If I messed up the numbers - please enlighten me.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT




Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder
and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT




Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
13
You might hit him up for a DVD burner. That would give you 4.7 gig capacity.

Personally, I just got myself into the habit of putting last nights tape into my briefcase each morning and pulling out the old one. It gives a pretty secure feeling because I don't have to count on anyone else to do it.

Rick Gors



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
14
I copy the database to my laptop once a week, which has Vantage installed on it. The double benefit is: Offsite backup, reference from home from problems that come up.

Troy Funte
Liberty Electronics

----- Original Message -----
From: Rick Gors
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 8:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location


You might hit him up for a DVD burner. That would give you 4.7 gig capacity.

Personally, I just got myself into the habit of putting last nights tape into my briefcase each morning and pulling out the old one. It gives a pretty secure feeling because I don't have to count on anyone else to do it.

Rick Gors



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT




Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
15
Troy- That certainly justifies the laptop - and pays for it too. Good
idea. -Gary

-----Original Message-----
From: Troy Funte [mailto:tfunte@...]
Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 10:15 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location


I copy the database to my laptop once a week, which has Vantage installed on
it. The double benefit is: Offsite backup, reference from home from
problems that come up.

Troy Funte
Liberty Electronics

----- Original Message -----
From: Rick Gors
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 8:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location


You might hit him up for a DVD burner. That would give you 4.7 gig
capacity.

Personally, I just got myself into the habit of putting last nights tape
into my briefcase each morning and pulling out the old one. It gives a
pretty secure feeling because I don't have to count on anyone else to do it.

Rick Gors



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT




Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
16
Better yet - if you are using probkup on the server and prorestore on the
laptop, it verifies that the backups you are doing are good.

Rick


>-----Original Message-----
>From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
>Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 10:28 AM
>To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: RE: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location
>
>
>Troy- That certainly justifies the laptop - and pays for it
>too. Good
>idea. -Gary
>
>
17
I put my tape in my shirt pocket, if we have a fire, as long as I get out
the tape does to!

-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Gors [mailto:rgors@...]
Sent: Tuesday, February 05, 2002 8:28 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] [Off Topic] Back Up to a Different Location [SMC
WIRE FABRICATORS]


You might hit him up for a DVD burner. That would give you 4.7 gig
capacity.

Personally, I just got myself into the habit of putting last nights tape
into my briefcase each morning and pulling out the old one. It gives a
pretty secure feeling because I don't have to count on anyone else to do it.

Rick Gors



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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