This enhancement request number is not correct. Just talked to Vantage support.
--
Brian W. Spolarich ~ Manager, Information Services ~ Advanced Photonix / Picometrix
    bspolarich@... ~ 734-864-5618 ~ www.advancedphotonix.com
-----Original Message-----
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of LeAnn Marruffo
Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 4:34 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
All,
Turns out there is an outstanding enhancement request for this from
v6. (I guess, since there are only 10-15 names on it, they aren't giving
it any weight)
Enhancement request number: 9601MPS
If seeing this enhancement get some activity is something your company
would like to support, please call tech support, and reference this
number.
Thanks!
- leAnn
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 12:08 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
Matt,
Same here.. No gripes (yet?) from outside auditors but this change log
behavior is a pain INTERNALLY when we want to know who errantly deleted
some record (so we can focus on why in order to try and prevent it in
the future).
Seems to me the current "upon deletion" log processing (go find every
reference to the deleted record and wipe them from the log) is not only
dumb, it requires more work than simply adding a final log reference as
to the date/time/user who deleted the record (and what they record key
was).
On the face of it, it would seem an easy fix to put in place but perhaps
it is something inherent in the progress layer (that exists whether you
are progress or sql) that makes it NOT such a little thing to fix.
(I really doubt it though... Probably just not enough people screaming
about it yet to get action.)
Rob
________________________________
From: "Sweny, Matt" <matts@... <mailto:matts%40modernind.com>
<vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> >
Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 11:52:47 AM
Subject: RE: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
Rob,
Agreed, borderline SOX issue when deleting the entire transaction. I
thought a line (on existing transaction) was being deleted and the log
for that would go away........ ... which would be a problem. The change
logs for existing transactions has been invaluable for us.
I can say our outside auditors have not questioned missing or out of
sequence invoice numbers. They do question and audit check numbers and
inventory ticket numbers and any missing sequence is a serious issue.
There would need to be some "other" kind of change log at a higher
system level to track the transactions. As it is now if a transaction
does not exist in the system there is no place to log that it ever was
created or deleted.
I suppose one could create some kind of BPM that detects when the entire
transaction is being deleted, then pushes out information to a table or
excel or access. As a work around for leAnn. I would support any
enhancement request for this functionality in vantage that leAnn is
seeking, we could have used something like that on several occasions.
The AR invoice works the same way as PO's. If I delete a PO (prior to
receiving anything against it) then go and create another PO to replace
the one deleted. Vantage will skip that PO # deleted and continue with
the sequence. This should not be a problem with AR ............ AS LONG
AS someone does not delete the vantage shipment. Because you can always
run the "shipped but not invoiced" report to make sure everything has
been invoiced. If the vantage shipment is deleted this the uninvoiced
shipment would not show on the report.
Matt Sweny
Purchasing Manager
Modern Industries Inc.
814-455-8061
matts@modernind. com<mailto:matts@modernind. com>
____________ _________ _________ __
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com] On
Behalf Of robertb_versa@ yahoo.com
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 10:33 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
Thanks leAnn for restating it so much more clearly than I with your
example.
Matt - It's not a total loss of the log file but (in my opinion) a
borderline Sarb-Ox non-compliance.
What gets change logged is entirely voluntary (you CAN choose to chglog
nothing).
I have little confidence (because of the breadth and depth of bugs -
more often than not glossed over as 'working as designed' by Support)
information required to be auditable is in fact reliably auditable.
Rob
--- Original Message ---
From:"LeAnn Marruffo" <lmarruffo@steren. com<mailto:lmarruffo% 40steren.
com>>
Sent:Thu 6/18/09 7:54 pm
To:<vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>>
Subj:RE: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
No, the only log record deleted is for the line deleted. (I had an
invoice group with 2 invoices, 123 and 124. I deleted 123. The log of
123 being created was also deleted. Log for 124 being created is still
there.) It's still an issue for me, because, as in your example, vantage
does not re-use invoice numbers. If I delete invoice 123, and then want
to re-issue, it will come in as invoice 125, and I have effectively
"burned" an invoice number. Our site requires that all invoice numbers
be accounted for, so I was hoping that I could show the creation and
deletion of the invoice in the change log, but no....
UGH. Is there an SCR for this, or an enhancement request I can add my
name to?
As always, thanks for all your help!
- leAnn
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>] On
Behalf
Of Sweny, Matt
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 3:22 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Subject: RE: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
I am confused. When you say deleting the record deletes the log file. Do
you mean deleting the log entry "record" or deleting the transaction
"record".
If deleting the transaction record, for example deleting line 10 on a
po, deletes the entire log (and all other log entries) for the other 9
po lines then we are going to have a heck of a SOX (Sarbanes Oxley)
issue. We are planning to convert from .305 to .40x soon.
Matt Sweny
<mailto:matts@modernind. com<mailto:matts% 40modernind. com>
<mailto:matts% 40modernind. com> >
____________ _________ _________ __
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com> ] On
Behalf Of Robert Brown
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 6:08 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Subject: Re: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
leAnn
True on 405a as well.
Solution will be when the brain trust at Epcior realizes the most
important change log record is usually one indicating the who/when of an
accidental record deletion.
Then maybe they'll change the logging process so deletion of the logged
record doesn't also delete the record in the log OF the deletion.
...That's confusing just to read! :)
Rob
____________ _________ _________ __
From: leann_37 <lmarruffo@steren. com<mailto:lmarruffo% 40steren. com>
<mailto:lmarruffo% 40steren. com>
<mailto:lmarruffo% 40steren. com>>
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 5:51:01 PM
Subject: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
All,
It seems like there was s discussion concerning the fact tha tin 407A,
if you are creating change logs, but then delete a record, the change
log is also deleted. (This is true- I am having this issue, as well.)
What was the resolution? (I searched around, but cannot find the earlier
thread- any help would be appreciated! )
Thanks in advance!
- leAnn
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
____________ _____
____________ _________ _________ __
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------------------------------------
Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
--
Brian W. Spolarich ~ Manager, Information Services ~ Advanced Photonix / Picometrix
    bspolarich@... ~ 734-864-5618 ~ www.advancedphotonix.com
-----Original Message-----
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of LeAnn Marruffo
Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 4:34 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
All,
Turns out there is an outstanding enhancement request for this from
v6. (I guess, since there are only 10-15 names on it, they aren't giving
it any weight)
Enhancement request number: 9601MPS
If seeing this enhancement get some activity is something your company
would like to support, please call tech support, and reference this
number.
Thanks!
- leAnn
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 12:08 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
Matt,
Same here.. No gripes (yet?) from outside auditors but this change log
behavior is a pain INTERNALLY when we want to know who errantly deleted
some record (so we can focus on why in order to try and prevent it in
the future).
Seems to me the current "upon deletion" log processing (go find every
reference to the deleted record and wipe them from the log) is not only
dumb, it requires more work than simply adding a final log reference as
to the date/time/user who deleted the record (and what they record key
was).
On the face of it, it would seem an easy fix to put in place but perhaps
it is something inherent in the progress layer (that exists whether you
are progress or sql) that makes it NOT such a little thing to fix.
(I really doubt it though... Probably just not enough people screaming
about it yet to get action.)
Rob
________________________________
From: "Sweny, Matt" <matts@... <mailto:matts%40modernind.com>
>To: "vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> "
<vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> >
Sent: Friday, June 19, 2009 11:52:47 AM
Subject: RE: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
Rob,
Agreed, borderline SOX issue when deleting the entire transaction. I
thought a line (on existing transaction) was being deleted and the log
for that would go away........ ... which would be a problem. The change
logs for existing transactions has been invaluable for us.
I can say our outside auditors have not questioned missing or out of
sequence invoice numbers. They do question and audit check numbers and
inventory ticket numbers and any missing sequence is a serious issue.
There would need to be some "other" kind of change log at a higher
system level to track the transactions. As it is now if a transaction
does not exist in the system there is no place to log that it ever was
created or deleted.
I suppose one could create some kind of BPM that detects when the entire
transaction is being deleted, then pushes out information to a table or
excel or access. As a work around for leAnn. I would support any
enhancement request for this functionality in vantage that leAnn is
seeking, we could have used something like that on several occasions.
The AR invoice works the same way as PO's. If I delete a PO (prior to
receiving anything against it) then go and create another PO to replace
the one deleted. Vantage will skip that PO # deleted and continue with
the sequence. This should not be a problem with AR ............ AS LONG
AS someone does not delete the vantage shipment. Because you can always
run the "shipped but not invoiced" report to make sure everything has
been invoiced. If the vantage shipment is deleted this the uninvoiced
shipment would not show on the report.
Matt Sweny
Purchasing Manager
Modern Industries Inc.
814-455-8061
matts@modernind. com<mailto:matts@modernind. com>
____________ _________ _________ __
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com] On
Behalf Of robertb_versa@ yahoo.com
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 10:33 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
Thanks leAnn for restating it so much more clearly than I with your
example.
Matt - It's not a total loss of the log file but (in my opinion) a
borderline Sarb-Ox non-compliance.
What gets change logged is entirely voluntary (you CAN choose to chglog
nothing).
I have little confidence (because of the breadth and depth of bugs -
more often than not glossed over as 'working as designed' by Support)
information required to be auditable is in fact reliably auditable.
Rob
--- Original Message ---
From:"LeAnn Marruffo" <lmarruffo@steren. com<mailto:lmarruffo% 40steren.
com>>
Sent:Thu 6/18/09 7:54 pm
To:<vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>>
Subj:RE: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
No, the only log record deleted is for the line deleted. (I had an
invoice group with 2 invoices, 123 and 124. I deleted 123. The log of
123 being created was also deleted. Log for 124 being created is still
there.) It's still an issue for me, because, as in your example, vantage
does not re-use invoice numbers. If I delete invoice 123, and then want
to re-issue, it will come in as invoice 125, and I have effectively
"burned" an invoice number. Our site requires that all invoice numbers
be accounted for, so I was hoping that I could show the creation and
deletion of the invoice in the change log, but no....
UGH. Is there an SCR for this, or an enhancement request I can add my
name to?
As always, thanks for all your help!
- leAnn
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>] On
Behalf
Of Sweny, Matt
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 3:22 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Subject: RE: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
I am confused. When you say deleting the record deletes the log file. Do
you mean deleting the log entry "record" or deleting the transaction
"record".
If deleting the transaction record, for example deleting line 10 on a
po, deletes the entire log (and all other log entries) for the other 9
po lines then we are going to have a heck of a SOX (Sarbanes Oxley)
issue. We are planning to convert from .305 to .40x soon.
Matt Sweny
<mailto:matts@modernind. com<mailto:matts% 40modernind. com>
<mailto:matts% 40modernind. com> >
____________ _________ _________ __
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com> ] On
Behalf Of Robert Brown
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 6:08 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Subject: Re: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
leAnn
True on 405a as well.
Solution will be when the brain trust at Epcior realizes the most
important change log record is usually one indicating the who/when of an
accidental record deletion.
Then maybe they'll change the logging process so deletion of the logged
record doesn't also delete the record in the log OF the deletion.
...That's confusing just to read! :)
Rob
____________ _________ _________ __
From: leann_37 <lmarruffo@steren. com<mailto:lmarruffo% 40steren. com>
<mailto:lmarruffo% 40steren. com>
<mailto:lmarruffo% 40steren. com>>
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
<mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Sent: Thursday, June 18, 2009 5:51:01 PM
Subject: [Vantage] change log being deleted - vantage 407A
All,
It seems like there was s discussion concerning the fact tha tin 407A,
if you are creating change logs, but then delete a record, the change
log is also deleted. (This is true- I am having this issue, as well.)
What was the resolution? (I searched around, but cannot find the earlier
thread- any help would be appreciated! )
Thanks in advance!
- leAnn
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
____________ _____
____________ _________ _________ __
This e-mail transmission and any attachments to it are intended
solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom it is
addressed and may contain confidential and privileged
information. If you are not the intended recipient, your use,
forwarding, printing, storing, disseminating, distribution, or
copying of this communication is prohibited. If you received
this communication in error, please notify the sender
immediately by replying to this message and delete it from your
computer.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Click here
<https://www.mailcontrol.com/sr/wQw0zmjPoHdJTZGyOCrrhg==
Ms6+WBQ6Y5oEAT98yz!UX9fL8lDaqp82wJsAI1jSF4rfTg==> to report this email
as spam.
This message has been scanned for malware by SurfControl plc. www.surfcontrol.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
------------------------------------
Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links