OT: Vantage and Switches

Yahoo Archive
1
Thanks everybody for the info on the switches. Got a better picture of how
I stand on this now. -Gary

-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Siebers [mailto:paul.siebers@...]
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 11:19 AM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


good thing I deleted Outlook's "adult" filter....

-----Original Message-----
From: Cole, Dave [mailto:dave@...]
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 11:17 AM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Gary,



I have four of these switches. The best way to connect the others is to but
the fiber interface kit or even go with the gigabit interface.

Mine are all hooker together between buildings with 100mb fiber.



Dave



-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 12:09 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches



Thanks Rick. Great info. I'll see what that does when get some time to
look at the switch documentation. We have two 24-port 3Com 3300
auto-sensing 10/100 switches, linked together as one 48-port module via
their proprietary cable. When I bought the third 3300 24-port switch, it
would have cost significantly more to link this in with the others the same
way. So I just plugged it in to the other switch using a crossover cable -
port-to-port. The network does seem like it could use some performance
help. So that may be the problem. Thanks again.

Gary

-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Spriggle [mailto:rspriggle@...]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 11:02 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Gary,

If you have two switches plugged together and both are auto-sensing 10/100,
what they try to do is negotiate the best speed - that being 10mpbs full or
half-duplex or 100mbps full or half. Sometimes switches are known to
negotiate themselves down to 10mbps at half-duplex. If the "master" hub is
manageable, you can set the speed of each individual port - ie if you have a
10/100 hub or switch connected to that port, then set it to 100mpbs only so
it won't go lower.

Rick

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
>Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 10:07 AM
>To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches
>
>
>"Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz
>switch? this can
>also
>cause problems." - David, what did you mean, whey you said this?
>
>
>Gary Polvinale
>Denton ATD
>


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2
Currently, we're running a 10Mb network comprised of hubs. I think
they're all half-duplex. I want to upgrade the network to 100Mb. I
bought a new 100Mb switch and put it in place of one of our main
hubs (the one the Vantage server is plugged into). I found out
quickly that hubs and switches don't mix. This one switch slowed
the whole network down. I changed all the clients plugged into this
switch to 10-half duplex and their connections were much slower than
normal, had to switch them back to 100-full, which seemed to slow
down the network for the rest of the users. I tried this as a test
to convince management that we need to do the upgrade but it
backfired. I know that it's all or none, we put in all switches or
leave it as is.

My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in.

Any tips would be greatly appreciated,

Thanks!
3
You should be able to run switches and hubs at the same time with no problem
unless you have some freaky brand of equipment.

-----Original Message-----
From: phlegmhurl [mailto:brannab@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 12:49 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Currently, we're running a 10Mb network comprised of hubs. I think
they're all half-duplex. I want to upgrade the network to 100Mb. I
bought a new 100Mb switch and put it in place of one of our main
hubs (the one the Vantage server is plugged into). I found out
quickly that hubs and switches don't mix. This one switch slowed
the whole network down. I changed all the clients plugged into this
switch to 10-half duplex and their connections were much slower than
normal, had to switch them back to 100-full, which seemed to slow
down the network for the rest of the users. I tried this as a test
to convince management that we need to do the upgrade but it
backfired. I know that it's all or none, we put in all switches or
leave it as is.

My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in.

Any tips would be greatly appreciated,

Thanks!



Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
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Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
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(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
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4
We have two 100Mb switches and a mix of 10 and 100Mb hubs. The one thing we
found is that things improved once the switch realized that the hubs were
only half-duplex. The first time I hooked it all up, it tried to connect to
the half-duplex hubs at full-duplex, which caused all sorts of problems.
Resetting the switch a couple of times fixed it.

Brian Boyes,
Systems Administrator,
Precision Resource Canada Ltd.
<http://www.precisionresource.com>
<mailto:brianb@...>

> -----Original Message-----
> My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
> just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
> over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
> Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in..
5
I agree. We have switches and some old hubs. The servers go into the
switch and the hubs and other switch connect to that switch. Once in awhile
things bog down so I power the whole stack off then restart the hubs then
the "master" switch last and it has always fixed things right away.
-Todd C.

-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Boyes [mailto:brianb@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 1:17 PM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


We have two 100Mb switches and a mix of 10 and 100Mb hubs. The one thing we
found is that things improved once the switch realized that the hubs were
only half-duplex. The first time I hooked it all up, it tried to connect to
the half-duplex hubs at full-duplex, which caused all sorts of problems.
Resetting the switch a couple of times fixed it.

Brian Boyes,
Systems Administrator,
Precision Resource Canada Ltd.
< http://www.precisionresource.com <http://www.precisionresource.com> >
<mailto:brianb@...>

> -----Original Message-----
> My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
> just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
> over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
> Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in..


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6
Speaking of half and full duplex; according to Epicor's performance document
(1947MPS): "Progress performs much better when the network uses
"half-duplex". If a user is hesitant about this start with a couple
workstations and the server, set at half-duplex and try the login. If there
are switches in the network, these will need to be set at half-duplex also."

Interesting....

-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Boyes [mailto:brianb@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 1:17 PM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


We have two 100Mb switches and a mix of 10 and 100Mb hubs. The one thing we
found is that things improved once the switch realized that the hubs were
only half-duplex. The first time I hooked it all up, it tried to connect to
the half-duplex hubs at full-duplex, which caused all sorts of problems.
Resetting the switch a couple of times fixed it.

Brian Boyes,
Systems Administrator,
Precision Resource Canada Ltd.
< http://www.precisionresource.com <http://www.precisionresource.com> >
<mailto:brianb@...>

> -----Original Message-----
> My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
> just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
> over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
> Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in..


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Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
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7
It sounds like you have configuration issues with the way your network is
setup. Using 100 Mb switch for a backbone and 10 Mb hubs is a standard
configuration and should help performance compared to straight 10 Mb
network. What kind of a switch did you use? Did you give it some time to get
familiar with your network (yes, switches do perform better once get a
chance to learn)? Is your wiring up to par? Are the NICs that are plugged in
directly into 100 Mb working properly at that speed? I would get somebody
with a network analyzer in there if you do want to upgrade. On the other
hand for most small manufacturers 10Mb bandwidth is still sufficient, so
unless you have the need ...

Oleg Tumarkin
Intelligent Systems Integration
(330) 335-5291
olegt@...

"Making Intelligent Use of Technology"

-----Original Message-----
From: phlegmhurl [mailto:brannab@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 12:49 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Currently, we're running a 10Mb network comprised of hubs. I think
they're all half-duplex. I want to upgrade the network to 100Mb. I
bought a new 100Mb switch and put it in place of one of our main
hubs (the one the Vantage server is plugged into). I found out
quickly that hubs and switches don't mix. This one switch slowed
the whole network down. I changed all the clients plugged into this
switch to 10-half duplex and their connections were much slower than
normal, had to switch them back to 100-full, which seemed to slow
down the network for the rest of the users. I tried this as a test
to convince management that we need to do the upgrade but it
backfired. I know that it's all or none, we put in all switches or
leave it as is.

My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in.

Any tips would be greatly appreciated,

Thanks!



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8
That is truly bizarre.

When I introduced a 10/100 switch into our network, log-on time went from 30
plus seconds to under five seconds. It worked like a champ....

Fausto

-----Original Message-----
From: Leonard, Jeremy [mailto:jleonard@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 12:57 PM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches

You should be able to run switches and hubs at the same time with no problem
unless you have some freaky brand of equipment.

-----Original Message-----
From: phlegmhurl [mailto:brannab@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 12:49 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Currently, we're running a 10Mb network comprised of hubs. I think
they're all half-duplex. I want to upgrade the network to 100Mb. I
bought a new 100Mb switch and put it in place of one of our main
hubs (the one the Vantage server is plugged into). I found out
quickly that hubs and switches don't mix. This one switch slowed
the whole network down. I changed all the clients plugged into this
switch to 10-half duplex and their connections were much slower than
normal, had to switch them back to 100-full, which seemed to slow
down the network for the rest of the users. I tried this as a test
to convince management that we need to do the upgrade but it
backfired. I know that it's all or none, we put in all switches or
leave it as is.

My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in.

Any tips would be greatly appreciated,

Thanks!



Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/



Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
9
I think you have some major issues with your existing system. If the servers
and 10 MHz hubs plug into the 100 MHz switch, it should work with no
problems. General bandwidth across the switch will increase. Are your
workstations running Win95 or Win98? If so, you might want to consider
turning off the broadcast option on the NIC as this polls the network and
can slow it down. (I am assuming you are using TCP/IP and not netbui which
is designed for small home or local networks only.)
Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz switch? this can also
cause problems.
Are your network cables Cat 4 (4 wire 10 MHz) or Cat5 (8 wire 100 MHz)? I
have seen this make 10 MHz cards run very slow half duplex into a 100 MHz
switch.
Failing all the above, it would be well worth your while to call in a
network specialist to test your system.
Regards,
David Sloan
Entech IT Manager

----- Original Message -----
From: "phlegmhurl" <brannab@...>
To: <vantage@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 4:19 AM
Subject: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


> Currently, we're running a 10Mb network comprised of hubs. I think
> they're all half-duplex. I want to upgrade the network to 100Mb. I
> bought a new 100Mb switch and put it in place of one of our main
> hubs (the one the Vantage server is plugged into). I found out
> quickly that hubs and switches don't mix. This one switch slowed
> the whole network down. I changed all the clients plugged into this
> switch to 10-half duplex and their connections were much slower than
> normal, had to switch them back to 100-full, which seemed to slow
> down the network for the rest of the users. I tried this as a test
> to convince management that we need to do the upgrade but it
> backfired. I know that it's all or none, we put in all switches or
> leave it as is.
>
> My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
> just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
> over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
> Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in.
>
> Any tips would be greatly appreciated,
>
> Thanks!
>
>
>
> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
10
"Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz switch? this can
also
cause problems." - David, what did you mean, whey you said this?


Gary Polvinale
Denton ATD


-----Original Message-----
From: David Sloan [mailto:dsloan@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 7:18 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


I think you have some major issues with your existing system. If the servers
and 10 MHz hubs plug into the 100 MHz switch, it should work with no
problems. General bandwidth across the switch will increase. Are your
workstations running Win95 or Win98? If so, you might want to consider
turning off the broadcast option on the NIC as this polls the network and
can slow it down. (I am assuming you are using TCP/IP and not netbui which
is designed for small home or local networks only.)
Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz switch? this can also
cause problems.
Are your network cables Cat 4 (4 wire 10 MHz) or Cat5 (8 wire 100 MHz)? I
have seen this make 10 MHz cards run very slow half duplex into a 100 MHz
switch.
Failing all the above, it would be well worth your while to call in a
network specialist to test your system.
Regards,
David Sloan
Entech IT Manager

----- Original Message -----
From: "phlegmhurl" <brannab@...>
To: <vantage@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 4:19 AM
Subject: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


> Currently, we're running a 10Mb network comprised of hubs. I think
> they're all half-duplex. I want to upgrade the network to 100Mb. I
> bought a new 100Mb switch and put it in place of one of our main
> hubs (the one the Vantage server is plugged into). I found out
> quickly that hubs and switches don't mix. This one switch slowed
> the whole network down. I changed all the clients plugged into this
> switch to 10-half duplex and their connections were much slower than
> normal, had to switch them back to 100-full, which seemed to slow
> down the network for the rest of the users. I tried this as a test
> to convince management that we need to do the upgrade but it
> backfired. I know that it's all or none, we put in all switches or
> leave it as is.
>
> My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
> just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
> over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
> Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in.
>
> Any tips would be greatly appreciated,
>
> Thanks!
>
>
>
> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>



Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
11
Everything runs better on switches!



I would say that my network traffic dropped to less than 10% of what it was
when I was running on hubs. I also ran several hubs with one switch until I
replaced them all and had no trouble at all. I plugged the connection for
the hub backbone into port one of the switch and it works just fine.




Dave Cole

Reeder & Kline Machine Company, Inc.



-----Original Message-----
From: phlegmhurl [mailto:brannab@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 12:49 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches



Currently, we're running a 10Mb network comprised of hubs. I think
they're all half-duplex. I want to upgrade the network to 100Mb. I
bought a new 100Mb switch and put it in place of one of our main
hubs (the one the Vantage server is plugged into). I found out
quickly that hubs and switches don't mix. This one switch slowed
the whole network down. I changed all the clients plugged into this
switch to 10-half duplex and their connections were much slower than
normal, had to switch them back to 100-full, which seemed to slow
down the network for the rest of the users. I tried this as a test
to convince management that we need to do the upgrade but it
backfired. I know that it's all or none, we put in all switches or
leave it as is.

My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in.

Any tips would be greatly appreciated,

Thanks!






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Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
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<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/>
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages>
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http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
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12
Anbody using VLANs?

We currently have a Two VLANs. One for our Apple Computers (10 Computers)
and one for the rest of the TCP/IP computers. (Approx 80 computers)

Does anybody have a rule of thumb of when to start segmenting the LAN? Is 80
computers too much on one segment, should I consider added an additional
VLAN?

Thanks in advance,

Fausto

-----Original Message-----
From: Cole, Dave [mailto:dave@...]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 10:27 AM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches

Everything runs better on switches!



I would say that my network traffic dropped to less than 10% of what it was
when I was running on hubs. I also ran several hubs with one switch until I
replaced them all and had no trouble at all. I plugged the connection for
the hub backbone into port one of the switch and it works just fine.




Dave Cole

Reeder & Kline Machine Company, Inc.



-----Original Message-----
From: phlegmhurl [mailto:brannab@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 12:49 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches



Currently, we're running a 10Mb network comprised of hubs. I think
they're all half-duplex. I want to upgrade the network to 100Mb. I
bought a new 100Mb switch and put it in place of one of our main
hubs (the one the Vantage server is plugged into). I found out
quickly that hubs and switches don't mix. This one switch slowed
the whole network down. I changed all the clients plugged into this
switch to 10-half duplex and their connections were much slower than
normal, had to switch them back to 100-full, which seemed to slow
down the network for the rest of the users. I tried this as a test
to convince management that we need to do the upgrade but it
backfired. I know that it's all or none, we put in all switches or
leave it as is.

My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in.

Any tips would be greatly appreciated,

Thanks!






Yahoo! Groups Sponsor



ADVERTISEMENT

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Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/>
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages>
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links>

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
13
We replaced several HUBs with Switches. As I recall the first Switch I
installed, a 10/100, was the one the Vantage server was connected to. It
did slow things down... I put the Vantage server back on the old 10mb hub
and started upgrading other parts of the network and all was fine. A few
weeks later I put a new switch in for the vantage server and it worked with
some noted performance increase.

We saw some increase in network speed with the switches. From what I
understand the difference in a switch and a hub is that a switch has a built
in ARP table. It keeps up with each NIC connected to it and can send
information for each computer directly to it...where as a hub is all
broadcast.

I have had some small problems with some parts of the network after a major
power outage and the batteries finally let everything power off. When normal
power is restored if I power cycle the switches feeding those branches of
the network everything kicks back in. I didn't have that problem with the
hubs.

FYI
Paul L.
Everything runs better on switches!



I would say that my network traffic dropped to less than 10% of what it
was
when I was running on hubs. I also ran several hubs with one switch until
I
replaced them all and had no trouble at all. I plugged the connection for
the hub backbone into port one of the switch and it works just fine.




Dave Cole

Reeder & Kline Machine Company, Inc.



Currently, we're running a 10Mb network comprised of hubs. I think
they're all half-duplex. I want to upgrade the network to 100Mb. I
bought a new 100Mb switch and put it in place of one of our main
hubs (the one the Vantage server is plugged into). I found out
quickly that hubs and switches don't mix. This one switch slowed
the whole network down. I changed all the clients plugged into this
switch to 10-half duplex and their connections were much slower than
normal, had to switch them back to 100-full, which seemed to slow
down the network for the rest of the users. I tried this as a test
to convince management that we need to do the upgrade but it
backfired. I know that it's all or none, we put in all switches or
leave it as is.

My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in.

Any tips would be greatly appreciated,

Thanks!



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
14
Gary,

If you have two switches plugged together and both are auto-sensing 10/100,
what they try to do is negotiate the best speed - that being 10mpbs full or
half-duplex or 100mbps full or half. Sometimes switches are known to
negotiate themselves down to 10mbps at half-duplex. If the "master" hub is
manageable, you can set the speed of each individual port - ie if you have a
10/100 hub or switch connected to that port, then set it to 100mpbs only so
it won't go lower.

Rick

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
>Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 10:07 AM
>To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches
>
>
>"Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz
>switch? this can
>also
>cause problems." - David, what did you mean, whey you said this?
>
>
>Gary Polvinale
>Denton ATD
>
15
Thanks Rick. Great info. I'll see what that does when get some time to
look at the switch documentation. We have two 24-port 3Com 3300
auto-sensing 10/100 switches, linked together as one 48-port module via
their proprietary cable. When I bought the third 3300 24-port switch, it
would have cost significantly more to link this in with the others the same
way. So I just plugged it in to the other switch using a crossover cable -
port-to-port. The network does seem like it could use some performance
help. So that may be the problem. Thanks again.

Gary

-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Spriggle [mailto:rspriggle@...]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 11:02 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Gary,

If you have two switches plugged together and both are auto-sensing 10/100,
what they try to do is negotiate the best speed - that being 10mpbs full or
half-duplex or 100mbps full or half. Sometimes switches are known to
negotiate themselves down to 10mbps at half-duplex. If the "master" hub is
manageable, you can set the speed of each individual port - ie if you have a
10/100 hub or switch connected to that port, then set it to 100mpbs only so
it won't go lower.

Rick

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
>Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 10:07 AM
>To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches
>
>
>"Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz
>switch? this can
>also
>cause problems." - David, what did you mean, whey you said this?
>
>
>Gary Polvinale
>Denton ATD
>


Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
16
Gary,

FYI - I have a 24port 3Com 3300 switch as the main device in the server
room. That feeds two more identical ones in engineering, another in the
machine shop, one in a far reach of the building via fiber, and another
building via fiber in a conduit under the parking lot. I haven't changed a
setting on any of them. I plugged them all in at various stages of the
upgrade and it all worked with a noticeable speed increase. I'm sure using
all the same brand components helps matters.

Rick
17
I have had problems with a switch going into a hub, going into a switch. the
3 were different brands, and once or twice a week, the switch at the end of
the line would just freeze up. the (small) hub was used as a line driver as
the line to the other switch was 90 meters long (almost at the 100 m limit).
Ideally, your servers should go to the switch, which goes to hubs, which go
to workstations.

David Sloan

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gary Polvinale" <garyp@...>
To: <vantage@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 09, 2002 1:36 AM
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


> "Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz switch? this can
> also
> cause problems." - David, what did you mean, whey you said this?
>
>
> Gary Polvinale
> Denton ATD
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Sloan [mailto:dsloan@...]
> Sent: Thursday, March 07, 2002 7:18 PM
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches
>
>
> I think you have some major issues with your existing system. If the
servers
> and 10 MHz hubs plug into the 100 MHz switch, it should work with no
> problems. General bandwidth across the switch will increase. Are your
> workstations running Win95 or Win98? If so, you might want to consider
> turning off the broadcast option on the NIC as this polls the network and
> can slow it down. (I am assuming you are using TCP/IP and not netbui which
> is designed for small home or local networks only.)
> Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz switch? this can
also
> cause problems.
> Are your network cables Cat 4 (4 wire 10 MHz) or Cat5 (8 wire 100 MHz)? I
> have seen this make 10 MHz cards run very slow half duplex into a 100 MHz
> switch.
> Failing all the above, it would be well worth your while to call in a
> network specialist to test your system.
> Regards,
> David Sloan
> Entech IT Manager
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "phlegmhurl" <brannab@...>
> To: <vantage@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 4:19 AM
> Subject: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches
>
>
> > Currently, we're running a 10Mb network comprised of hubs. I think
> > they're all half-duplex. I want to upgrade the network to 100Mb. I
> > bought a new 100Mb switch and put it in place of one of our main
> > hubs (the one the Vantage server is plugged into). I found out
> > quickly that hubs and switches don't mix. This one switch slowed
> > the whole network down. I changed all the clients plugged into this
> > switch to 10-half duplex and their connections were much slower than
> > normal, had to switch them back to 100-full, which seemed to slow
> > down the network for the rest of the users. I tried this as a test
> > to convince management that we need to do the upgrade but it
> > backfired. I know that it's all or none, we put in all switches or
> > leave it as is.
> >
> > My question is: Does Vantage run better on a switched network or
> > just on hubs. While the 100MB switch was installed I copied files
> > over the network. They copied about 10 times faster than normal but
> > Vantage ran so slow that some clients took 5 minutes to log in.
> >
> > Any tips would be greatly appreciated,
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> >
> >
> > Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
> have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> > (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder
and
> Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> > (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> > (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>
>
>
> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
have
> already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
> Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
18
Gary,



I have four of these switches. The best way to connect the others is to but
the fiber interface kit or even go with the gigabit interface.

Mine are all hooker together between buildings with 100mb fiber.



Dave



-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 12:09 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches



Thanks Rick. Great info. I'll see what that does when get some time to
look at the switch documentation. We have two 24-port 3Com 3300
auto-sensing 10/100 switches, linked together as one 48-port module via
their proprietary cable. When I bought the third 3300 24-port switch, it
would have cost significantly more to link this in with the others the same
way. So I just plugged it in to the other switch using a crossover cable -
port-to-port. The network does seem like it could use some performance
help. So that may be the problem. Thanks again.

Gary

-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Spriggle [mailto:rspriggle@...]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 11:02 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Gary,

If you have two switches plugged together and both are auto-sensing 10/100,
what they try to do is negotiate the best speed - that being 10mpbs full or
half-duplex or 100mbps full or half. Sometimes switches are known to
negotiate themselves down to 10mbps at half-duplex. If the "master" hub is
manageable, you can set the speed of each individual port - ie if you have a
10/100 hub or switch connected to that port, then set it to 100mpbs only so
it won't go lower.

Rick

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
>Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 10:07 AM
>To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches
>
>
>"Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz
>switch? this can
>also
>cause problems." - David, what did you mean, whey you said this?
>
>
>Gary Polvinale
>Denton ATD
>


Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/>
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages>
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links>

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>








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asp?sc=1485REC3> Click Here!



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l/S=1705007183:HM/A=995535/rand=890530235>


Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/>
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages>
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links>

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
19
good thing I deleted Outlook's "adult" filter....

-----Original Message-----
From: Cole, Dave [mailto:dave@...]
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 11:17 AM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Gary,



I have four of these switches. The best way to connect the others is to but
the fiber interface kit or even go with the gigabit interface.

Mine are all hooker together between buildings with 100mb fiber.



Dave



-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 12:09 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches



Thanks Rick. Great info. I'll see what that does when get some time to
look at the switch documentation. We have two 24-port 3Com 3300
auto-sensing 10/100 switches, linked together as one 48-port module via
their proprietary cable. When I bought the third 3300 24-port switch, it
would have cost significantly more to link this in with the others the same
way. So I just plugged it in to the other switch using a crossover cable -
port-to-port. The network does seem like it could use some performance
help. So that may be the problem. Thanks again.

Gary

-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Spriggle [mailto:rspriggle@...]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 11:02 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Gary,

If you have two switches plugged together and both are auto-sensing 10/100,
what they try to do is negotiate the best speed - that being 10mpbs full or
half-duplex or 100mbps full or half. Sometimes switches are known to
negotiate themselves down to 10mbps at half-duplex. If the "master" hub is
manageable, you can set the speed of each individual port - ie if you have a
10/100 hub or switch connected to that port, then set it to 100mpbs only so
it won't go lower.

Rick

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
>Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 10:07 AM
>To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches
>
>
>"Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz
>switch? this can
>also
>cause problems." - David, what did you mean, whey you said this?
>
>
>Gary Polvinale
>Denton ATD
>


Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/>
(2) To search through old msg's goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages>
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/links>

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
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20
Spell checkers don't catch everything! I guess I should have proofed it
better.





Dave



-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Siebers [mailto:paul.siebers@...]
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 11:19 AM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches



good thing I deleted Outlook's "adult" filter....

-----Original Message-----
From: Cole, Dave [mailto:dave@...]
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2002 11:17 AM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Gary,



I have four of these switches. The best way to connect the others is to but
the fiber interface kit or even go with the gigabit interface.

Mine are all hooker together between buildings with 100mb fiber.



Dave



-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 12:09 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches



Thanks Rick. Great info. I'll see what that does when get some time to
look at the switch documentation. We have two 24-port 3Com 3300
auto-sensing 10/100 switches, linked together as one 48-port module via
their proprietary cable. When I bought the third 3300 24-port switch, it
would have cost significantly more to link this in with the others the same
way. So I just plugged it in to the other switch using a crossover cable -
port-to-port. The network does seem like it could use some performance
help. So that may be the problem. Thanks again.

Gary

-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Spriggle [mailto:rspriggle@...]
Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 11:02 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches


Gary,

If you have two switches plugged together and both are auto-sensing 10/100,
what they try to do is negotiate the best speed - that being 10mpbs full or
half-duplex or 100mbps full or half. Sometimes switches are known to
negotiate themselves down to 10mbps at half-duplex. If the "master" hub is
manageable, you can set the speed of each individual port - ie if you have a
10/100 hub or switch connected to that port, then set it to 100mpbs only so
it won't go lower.

Rick

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Gary Polvinale [mailto:garyp@...]
>Sent: Friday, March 08, 2002 10:07 AM
>To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: RE: [Vantage] OT: Vantage and Switches
>
>
>"Do you have other switches plugged into the new 100MHz
>switch? this can
>also
>cause problems." - David, what did you mean, whey you said this?
>
>
>Gary Polvinale
>Denton ATD
>


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